There's no such thing as cyberspace....

All philosophical and science including tech discussions should go here.
User avatar
Doctor Azo
Head Admin
Head Admin
Posts: 2705
Joined: Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:02 am
Location: SW England, UK
Medals: 6
Referrer AGN's MC player AGN's TF2 player First year AGNer Kiloposter HoW access
Has Liked: 168 posts
Liked for: 1161 posts

There's no such thing as cyberspace....

Postby Doctor Azo » Thu May 19, 2016 12:56 pm

Or it's not what you think.

Cyberspace is a termed coined to help people understand resources (data) accessible, stored and transferable across the global network of computer networks called the internet. The internet implies two things: the protocol (or rules for propagating and handling groups of binary data called packets) and the physical/electronical infrastructure comprised of mainly data cables, packet switching equipment and computers. Using the internet requires a computer with internet access, which runs software for decoding and encoding these messages and processing it to present to the end user. Cyberspace is not a magical interdimensional resource as parodied on TV Tropes: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Cyberspace

It's an old term, but also inaccurate because there's no interdimensional or single space online....everything propagates through series of interconnected but independent links/nodes. Each connection can work very differently but have one sole purpose: to exchange binary data, preferably uncorrupted. The rules and meaning in the binary digits is up to the hardware, which is electronically built or programmed to perform series or cycles of operations and functions for a grater purpose; all deliberately designed by humans.

(Tech blah blah blahs ahead, but sorta explained)

There's nothing special or fantastic about binary data. It's versatile but not without it's shortcomings. Digital circuits are very efficient and easy to work with (compared to others) once you get the basis of it and boolean logic, allowing the ability to manipulate numbers (preferably integers) by the masses faster and more accurately than humans. The problem is when working with images, for example, it gets a lot more complicated. The most simple solution is reproduce the image as a mosaic of coloured dots (everything is on your screen) called pixels and assign each pixel 3 bytes for the Red, Green and Blue values. However each byte can only represent 256 numbers, 0 - 255. If you want more colours, you need more bytes. Still, even with 3 bytes per pixel the amount of data can be very large and inefficient (particularly with domestic internet connections), so usually Jpegs, Gifs and PNG's are used instead which are less straightforward but affective reduce the quantity of bytes for storage and transmission. These images over the internet are merely series of bytes or bits. The same goes for text, HTTP requests, packet headers, IP addresses, sound files, files, everything.

Some erroneously believe that playing online games means everything you see and hear comes over the internet as you play, when in fact generally very little does. When playing online games, most of the data actually being exchanged between your computer and the server/other player's computer includes positions of mobile entities (characters, sometimes other parts), directions, movement data (like speed) as well as chat messages (text), avatar data and sometimes environment data. It can be as simple as X Y co-ordinates expressed as two bytes or series of bytes including data like MineCraft blocks, state of said blocks and other meta data. Sometimes images and 3D meshes are included, but not common because with most online games the copy of the graphics are pre-installed along with other media on the client end. The reason for this is efficiency: no one wants to have graphics and sounds constantly being transferred for every client eating away the bandwidth or causing incessant lag surges (network latency due to high traffic and low capacity). In fact web browses often store a cache of web files instead of requesting them every time you browse page to page; instead it just asks the web server "hey has this image been updated since [time stamp]?" and fetches it if so. 3D meshes can be made up of many thousands of vertices or points defined by vectors (X, Y, Z and maybe direction) which usually are made up of several bytes....and then you got textures including images and things like bump maps and maps that make your objects shiny and stuff....so yeah media files to potentially thousands of clients at the same time would jam up the limited roads fast.

Tech babble over, mostly. Now for the easier bits (pun unintended):

A better analogy of the internet would be the road/traffic system we all know and (sometimes) love. The roads are the medium for the vehicles, the vehicles the medium for the people and property being transported. The rules of transport and knowledge of routes helps propagate these packages to the correct destination and minimizes collisions. Both roads and vehicles have limited capacity. However unlike traffic, internet packet switching actually involves computers and such hardware manufacturing, transmitting and reading/processing these packets of binary data. The packets themselves do not and can not propagate by themselves nor do they persist. They must be intercepted by an intelligent reader, governed by the protocol agreed by all parties involved, who then must copy the message contents, probably amending/appending the header, and then transmit the message in one form or another to the correct lane or road. Then, the next party must do the same, unless a IP node can say "oh hey it's addressed to me!" and then proceed to process the packet for itself. Well something like that anyway.

An even better analogy of the internet would be the good(ish) old fashioned postal service system. Every letter or parcel must have a valid destination written on it, in a particular format so the sorting offices and delivery people can deliver it. Some may need a stamp which costs money, some delivery services charge on the spot for handling the item(s). Some charge the recipient. For letters anyway, you need to put the letter, form or whatever in an envelope with a correct address to send on it (and the stamp if required) and then put into a post box (or even hand delivered, the rules there are less strict but that's irrelevant) where someone will come to empty the box (process and clear the buffer, cache, backlog, queue or stack) to take to the post office or sorting office, where a series of processing is performed to, well, sort the bunches out and send each to the correct branch, ready for hand-to-door delivery. The address on the envelope then allows the post person which door to stick the message into. We then read the name (and sometimes address) to know who it's for specifically and proceed to open it and "process" it, if necessary. Well that's how I live, I don't open anyone else's letters unless they ask me to and they don't open and read mine, well except my dad....but my dad was a git, so not relevant anyway.

I know pop culture and the media, particularly works of fiction like TV shows, love to spice it all up to make it much more interesting, flashy and even easy for the average human to conceive....but it's false and nonsense. In reality it is interesting for people like me who actually understand it, but for most it's a lot duller. Well, fibre optics aren't dull literally....they use light (sometimes many wavelengths/colours) to transfer digital data or sometimes analogue, although computers at the basis require digital electrical signals. Humans also use fibre optics for decoration....because "ooh pretty!". Well, they are! Simple, but pretty.

Basically, internet data packets are like enveloped letters but with lots of ones and zeros which would only frustrate a human reader, and in quantities that would flood a house and with speed/timing that would cause paper to ignite and shred in an instant.

Basically cables are like roads and routes but only much narrower and frustrating for any human to attempt to traverse and not even an electric car would be useful.

Basically wireless connections is like invisible cables, except no danger of being garotted and you're subjecting the vicinity to similar wavelengths of photonic energy of that we like to use to cook meals quickly with.

Basically internet protocol is like a global agreement and understanding for electronic devices with computers with electronic devices (yes, this is how it is these days) to virtually connect and exchange data. This is like languages shared between people and taught nationwide (as well as etiquette, laws, etc) so they can understand each other and make progress.

And as for storage: Nearly everything online is stored at least on some computer somewhere, almost certainly on a hard disk drive or solid state drive. Sometimes it's duplicated across many. Even if the data isn't written to disk/SSD, it is being held in temporary memory/RAM somewhere. If not, it's gone for good. Even in long submarine telecom cables with pulses or waves of light still in transit, the data would still exist in the buffer on one end at least - this is held for retransmission if necessary. It's all a matter of access - most data is accessible to the host machine only, mostly due to permissions and routing agreements or lack of.

A hacker is someone (or something) that exploits a glitch or security loophole to trigger the read, transmit and write over of said data or someone who otherwise somehow tricks the system (which often involves humans) into granting them permissions for access one way or another. Computers are good at upholding permissions and authority - but humans and the humans that program/design them aren't. Humans are good at looking at the "bigger picture" and know should be shared to who or what and what shouldn't, but computers aren't nor are humans good at instructing the computers all do's and don'ts. A hacker knows the software and their way around a system, but they don't need to be electrical/hardware specialists. Hardware hackers exist, but that's mainly for modifications rather than to break in to a remote service.
Community Rules | Newcomer FAQ | Our MC server FAQ | Our TF2 server FAQ
Need help with AGN? Check out the Tech forum.
Drop in suggestions or complaints in Suggestions forum.
Is it a private matter? PM me!
AGN's Twitter: @AceGamersNetwrk

"Creativity is intelligence having fun." - Albert Einstein
User avatar
dykath
Jr. Community Manager
Jr. Community Manager
Posts: 1773
Joined: Mon Feb 08, 2016 6:25 am
Location: Laniakea, Milky Way, Sol system, Earth
Medals: 7
Referrer AGN's MC player Nothing personal boss! AGN's TF2 player Kiloposter HoW access
Bug finder
Has Liked: 206 posts
Liked for: 645 posts
Contact:

Re: There's no such thing as cyberspace....

Postby dykath » Thu May 19, 2016 3:25 pm

warning i speak techno babble.
and really people actually thought that
Doctor Azo wrote: playing online games means everything you see and hear comes over the internet as you play

humm well then

thank you for the analogies there doctor
here is a video that explains it well
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_LPdttKXPc
I am who I am I don't need nor want a label I simply am who I am and your approval is not needed nor wanted I am me and me is pretty awesome.
the state of your life is nothing more than a reflection of your state of mind
If you never look up you will never see the sky, It may be raining but there is a rainbow above you
User avatar
Doctor Azo
Head Admin
Head Admin
Posts: 2705
Joined: Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:02 am
Location: SW England, UK
Medals: 6
Referrer AGN's MC player AGN's TF2 player First year AGNer Kiloposter HoW access
Has Liked: 168 posts
Liked for: 1161 posts

Re: There's no such thing as cyberspace....

Postby Doctor Azo » Thu May 19, 2016 3:29 pm

dykath wrote:warning i speak techno babble.
and really people actually thought that
Doctor Azo wrote: playing online games means everything you see and hear comes over the internet as you play

humm well then

thank you for the analogies there doctor
here is a video that explains it well
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_LPdttKXPc


Please do not misquote.

Some erroneously believe that playing online games means everything you see and hear comes over the internet as you play, when in fact generally very little does.
Community Rules | Newcomer FAQ | Our MC server FAQ | Our TF2 server FAQ
Need help with AGN? Check out the Tech forum.
Drop in suggestions or complaints in Suggestions forum.
Is it a private matter? PM me!
AGN's Twitter: @AceGamersNetwrk

"Creativity is intelligence having fun." - Albert Einstein
User avatar
dykath
Jr. Community Manager
Jr. Community Manager
Posts: 1773
Joined: Mon Feb 08, 2016 6:25 am
Location: Laniakea, Milky Way, Sol system, Earth
Medals: 7
Referrer AGN's MC player Nothing personal boss! AGN's TF2 player Kiloposter HoW access
Bug finder
Has Liked: 206 posts
Liked for: 645 posts
Contact:

Re: There's no such thing as cyberspace....

Postby dykath » Fri May 20, 2016 12:24 am

Doctor Azo wrote:Please do not misquote.

oh sorry for the misquote was not my intention to do so.
playing online games means everything you see and hear comes over the internet as you play

but the difference between this and this.
Some erroneously believe that playing online games means everything you see and hear comes over the internet as you play, when in fact generally very little does.

is only the fact that erroneously believe and that it is not true and that it is in fact very little. both pieces of information i know already that is why i only quoted.
playing online games means everything you see and hear comes over the internet as you play

and the only reason i only quoted this was because i did not know that piece of information. sorry for any confusion on this :SB:s
I am who I am I don't need nor want a label I simply am who I am and your approval is not needed nor wanted I am me and me is pretty awesome.
the state of your life is nothing more than a reflection of your state of mind
If you never look up you will never see the sky, It may be raining but there is a rainbow above you
User avatar
Doctor Azo
Head Admin
Head Admin
Posts: 2705
Joined: Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:02 am
Location: SW England, UK
Medals: 6
Referrer AGN's MC player AGN's TF2 player First year AGNer Kiloposter HoW access
Has Liked: 168 posts
Liked for: 1161 posts

Re: There's no such thing as cyberspace....

Postby Doctor Azo » Fri May 20, 2016 5:03 am

"playing online games means everything you see and hear comes over the internet as you play" makes it sound like I told a lie, which is misleading. :[:P]

By "Some erroneously believe that" I mean some people mistakenly believe it, or are misinformed. The last bit being left out was unnecessary too.

The problem with misquoting is with TL;DR or old posts or replies buried amongst many other posts people are less likely to read the original one and take misquotes for granted. Also creating false quotes is against the rules here.

Anyway here's something I found searching YouTube (my computer didn't find it, rather the YT servers did by doing a look up in their database with lists of tags, titles and descriptions) :[:P] :



Talking about searching....search engines don't scan the world wide web when you run a query, instead it runs it in their index/DB of cached website text data and such, which it built up previously. They use an army of bot/crawler software on their servers to automatically browse websites, following links, recording certain content and build these lists of relational and tagged data and update every now and then. This is why when using search engines sometimes you get outdated results. Also websites can block access to these search bots to some or all parts by telling them in robots.txt, using the htaccess and the browser or host name or blocking IP address ranges. If a SE crawler doesn't finds and crawl a website (remains unlinked/unreferenced, which is common with new sites) it won't list it in any search results.
Community Rules | Newcomer FAQ | Our MC server FAQ | Our TF2 server FAQ
Need help with AGN? Check out the Tech forum.
Drop in suggestions or complaints in Suggestions forum.
Is it a private matter? PM me!
AGN's Twitter: @AceGamersNetwrk

"Creativity is intelligence having fun." - Albert Einstein
User avatar
dykath
Jr. Community Manager
Jr. Community Manager
Posts: 1773
Joined: Mon Feb 08, 2016 6:25 am
Location: Laniakea, Milky Way, Sol system, Earth
Medals: 7
Referrer AGN's MC player Nothing personal boss! AGN's TF2 player Kiloposter HoW access
Bug finder
Has Liked: 206 posts
Liked for: 645 posts
Contact:

Re: There's no such thing as cyberspace....

Postby dykath » Fri May 20, 2016 6:34 am

Doctor Azo wrote:"playing online games means everything you see and hear comes over the internet as you play" makes it sound like I told a lie, which is misleading.

By "Some erroneously believe that" I mean some people mistakenly believe it, or are misinformed. The last bit being left out was unnecessary too.

The problem with misquoting is with TL;DR or old posts or replies buried amongst many other posts people are less likely to read the original one and take misquotes for granted. Also creating false quotes is against the rules here.

noted wont happen again :SBthumbsup
and humm nice video by the way :SBthumbsup
I am who I am I don't need nor want a label I simply am who I am and your approval is not needed nor wanted I am me and me is pretty awesome.
the state of your life is nothing more than a reflection of your state of mind
If you never look up you will never see the sky, It may be raining but there is a rainbow above you
User avatar
Doctor Azo
Head Admin
Head Admin
Posts: 2705
Joined: Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:02 am
Location: SW England, UK
Medals: 6
Referrer AGN's MC player AGN's TF2 player First year AGNer Kiloposter HoW access
Has Liked: 168 posts
Liked for: 1161 posts

Re: There's no such thing as cyberspace....

Postby Doctor Azo » Thu May 26, 2016 7:51 pm

I found this yesterday, which is an in-depth (and rather long) exploration of the obscure yet vast underlying infrastructure of the internet: http://arstechnica.co.uk/information-te ... last-mile/

And that's only half the story.
Community Rules | Newcomer FAQ | Our MC server FAQ | Our TF2 server FAQ
Need help with AGN? Check out the Tech forum.
Drop in suggestions or complaints in Suggestions forum.
Is it a private matter? PM me!
AGN's Twitter: @AceGamersNetwrk

"Creativity is intelligence having fun." - Albert Einstein
User avatar
Doctor Azo
Head Admin
Head Admin
Posts: 2705
Joined: Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:02 am
Location: SW England, UK
Medals: 6
Referrer AGN's MC player AGN's TF2 player First year AGNer Kiloposter HoW access
Has Liked: 168 posts
Liked for: 1161 posts

Re: There's no such thing as cyberspace....

Postby Doctor Azo » Tue May 31, 2016 9:48 pm

Ironically the one who first coined the term "cyberspace" and described it has since criticised it:

All I knew about the word "cyberspace" when I coined it, was that it seemed like an effective buzzword. It seemed evocative and essentially meaningless. It was suggestive of something, but had no real semantic meaning, even for me, as I saw it emerge on the page.


The funniest thing about it is "cyberspace" is no more than a human delusion. It's like how we see animals in clouds, faces on Mars and use every day objects and common natural events to explain things that are too small, obscure or big to perceive.
Community Rules | Newcomer FAQ | Our MC server FAQ | Our TF2 server FAQ
Need help with AGN? Check out the Tech forum.
Drop in suggestions or complaints in Suggestions forum.
Is it a private matter? PM me!
AGN's Twitter: @AceGamersNetwrk

"Creativity is intelligence having fun." - Albert Einstein
User avatar
Doctor Azo
Head Admin
Head Admin
Posts: 2705
Joined: Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:02 am
Location: SW England, UK
Medals: 6
Referrer AGN's MC player AGN's TF2 player First year AGNer Kiloposter HoW access
Has Liked: 168 posts
Liked for: 1161 posts

Re: There's no such thing as cyberspace....

Postby Doctor Azo » Thu Jul 28, 2016 12:53 pm

http://www.asexuality.org/en/topic/1425 ... -internet/

As you can expect with arrogant AVEN, they think they're smart but the evidence just says they're no smarter than the average member of their peers and refuse to learn better.

World Wide Web, a.k.a websites, was developed in the early 90's. The foundations of the Internet, which is a global network and network protocol of computers, was designed from the 60's and the first packet switching network developed in 1969. The WWW uses the modern internet (which was already established although rarely used domestically) as a medium.

The internet is over 17,000 days old.
Community Rules | Newcomer FAQ | Our MC server FAQ | Our TF2 server FAQ
Need help with AGN? Check out the Tech forum.
Drop in suggestions or complaints in Suggestions forum.
Is it a private matter? PM me!
AGN's Twitter: @AceGamersNetwrk

"Creativity is intelligence having fun." - Albert Einstein
User avatar
Doctor Azo
Head Admin
Head Admin
Posts: 2705
Joined: Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:02 am
Location: SW England, UK
Medals: 6
Referrer AGN's MC player AGN's TF2 player First year AGNer Kiloposter HoW access
Has Liked: 168 posts
Liked for: 1161 posts

Re: There's no such thing as cyberspace....

Postby Doctor Azo » Tue Apr 04, 2017 7:09 pm

1mo7hq.jpg


Yes, "....on the internet" is grammatically inaccurate and technically untrue. "Over the internet", or "via the internet" is the closest meaningful description. If something is hosted online, it's "hosted/accessible online". Data can't be "on the internet" because the internet is about the network and protocols that virtually link computers together to exchange said data. So the internet isn't a place, or even places, but rather a method.

What if I told you....

AGN isn't on the internet, but connected to it? :[B)]
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Community Rules | Newcomer FAQ | Our MC server FAQ | Our TF2 server FAQ
Need help with AGN? Check out the Tech forum.
Drop in suggestions or complaints in Suggestions forum.
Is it a private matter? PM me!
AGN's Twitter: @AceGamersNetwrk

"Creativity is intelligence having fun." - Albert Einstein
User avatar
dykath
Jr. Community Manager
Jr. Community Manager
Posts: 1773
Joined: Mon Feb 08, 2016 6:25 am
Location: Laniakea, Milky Way, Sol system, Earth
Medals: 7
Referrer AGN's MC player Nothing personal boss! AGN's TF2 player Kiloposter HoW access
Bug finder
Has Liked: 206 posts
Liked for: 645 posts
Contact:

Re: There's no such thing as cyberspace....

Postby dykath » Wed Apr 05, 2017 3:48 am

Doctor Azo wrote:http://www.asexuality.org/en/topic/142537-10000-days-of-the-internet/

As you can expect with arrogant AVEN, they think they're smart but the evidence just says they're no smarter than the average member of their peers and refuse to learn better.

World Wide Web, a.k.a websites, was developed in the early 90's. The foundations of the Internet, which is a global network and network protocol of computers, was designed from the 60's and the first packet switching network developed in 1969. The WWW uses the modern internet (which was already established although rarely used domestically) as a medium.

The internet is over 17,000 days old.

yes and one of the first networks was ARPANET.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARPANET
and was really the foundation the IP communications protocols that we use today. :SBthumbsup
I am who I am I don't need nor want a label I simply am who I am and your approval is not needed nor wanted I am me and me is pretty awesome.
the state of your life is nothing more than a reflection of your state of mind
If you never look up you will never see the sky, It may be raining but there is a rainbow above you
User avatar
Doctor Azo
Head Admin
Head Admin
Posts: 2705
Joined: Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:02 am
Location: SW England, UK
Medals: 6
Referrer AGN's MC player AGN's TF2 player First year AGNer Kiloposter HoW access
Has Liked: 168 posts
Liked for: 1161 posts

Re: There's no such thing as cyberspace....

Postby Doctor Azo » Wed Apr 05, 2017 2:41 pm

And to just think....TCP/TCP-esque is a lot more complicated than UDP. :[:P] The decommissioned ARPANET is coming up 50's years old too....
Community Rules | Newcomer FAQ | Our MC server FAQ | Our TF2 server FAQ
Need help with AGN? Check out the Tech forum.
Drop in suggestions or complaints in Suggestions forum.
Is it a private matter? PM me!
AGN's Twitter: @AceGamersNetwrk

"Creativity is intelligence having fun." - Albert Einstein
User avatar
dykath
Jr. Community Manager
Jr. Community Manager
Posts: 1773
Joined: Mon Feb 08, 2016 6:25 am
Location: Laniakea, Milky Way, Sol system, Earth
Medals: 7
Referrer AGN's MC player Nothing personal boss! AGN's TF2 player Kiloposter HoW access
Bug finder
Has Liked: 206 posts
Liked for: 645 posts
Contact:

Re: There's no such thing as cyberspace....

Postby dykath » Wed Apr 05, 2017 7:56 pm

Doctor Azo wrote:And to just think....TCP/TCP-esque is a lot more complicated than UDP. :[:P]

well of course TCP is more complicated than udp. tcp verifies the computer that its sending the packets too and udp is like eh what ever happens happens.
I am who I am I don't need nor want a label I simply am who I am and your approval is not needed nor wanted I am me and me is pretty awesome.
the state of your life is nothing more than a reflection of your state of mind
If you never look up you will never see the sky, It may be raining but there is a rainbow above you
User avatar
Doctor Azo
Head Admin
Head Admin
Posts: 2705
Joined: Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:02 am
Location: SW England, UK
Medals: 6
Referrer AGN's MC player AGN's TF2 player First year AGNer Kiloposter HoW access
Has Liked: 168 posts
Liked for: 1161 posts

Re: There's no such thing as cyberspace....

Postby Doctor Azo » Thu Apr 06, 2017 4:32 am

Well yeah....but just look at the (v4) headers in comparison:

Image

Applications can have their own verification methods though. TCP just handles most of the headaches of reliability for you.
Community Rules | Newcomer FAQ | Our MC server FAQ | Our TF2 server FAQ
Need help with AGN? Check out the Tech forum.
Drop in suggestions or complaints in Suggestions forum.
Is it a private matter? PM me!
AGN's Twitter: @AceGamersNetwrk

"Creativity is intelligence having fun." - Albert Einstein
User avatar
Doctor Azo
Head Admin
Head Admin
Posts: 2705
Joined: Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:02 am
Location: SW England, UK
Medals: 6
Referrer AGN's MC player AGN's TF2 player First year AGNer Kiloposter HoW access
Has Liked: 168 posts
Liked for: 1161 posts

Re: There's no such thing as cyberspace....

Postby Doctor Azo » Thu Jul 13, 2017 6:30 pm

Does the internet fall under telecommunications? Yes.

Should the internet be conquered, annexed or such? It can't. If someone is talking like it's some new land or magical realm discovered or created then they don't know what it is let alone what they're talking about. The internet was built for linking computer networks together, it's regulated by technicians and members of various groups and still falls under some local government laws and always has been; it's only more recently some governments and businesses have been trying to hold more direct power over its usage and capitalise on it more.

What is "interweb"? That's usually dished out to mock the unsavvy because a common misconception is the web and internet are the same, however sometimes the ignorant will use it themselves without realising this. When it comes to text and lack of context, it's not often easy to tell if someone is joking or untaught.

Why do so many call the web the internet then? Surely there's some similarity? It's a common misconception, which has gone too far. Some people can't tolerate the fact they've been ignorant and wrong for so long so cognitive distortion kicks to defend their ego - denialism, minimisation and arrogance takes over here. As long as many people and the media do it, many others will continue. The thing they have in common is they're built on various technologies to the point it's hard to understand how it works and the web has links, although a different kind. Both have fundamental protocols, with communication in mind. But the web was built for humans, the internet was built for computers. The word "web" and "net" perhaps added to the confusion.

Surely there is something fundamentally wrong with it that turns people bad? No. The interwebby magical trickery stuff was engineered for the transport of data between computers and their software alone to make it easy for researchers and the military to share stuff, then to allow users to easily communicate and so forth. Unfortunately the bad behaviour is purely human based and deep rooted in our psyche - the anonymity or sense of anonymity brings out the worst in us, however it's not difficult to do quite the opposite and do really awesome and kind things behind an anonymous identity. For some they choose to do more with their real names, face, etc but still behave worse or be more confrontational than RL because they either forget or (more likely) at least part of their mind still thinks/feels "I'm anonymous". Also with RL confrontations, the human mind fears immediate reprisal from their actions but when behind a visual display unit it doesn't, and probably doesn't afterwards. Everything comes with a price, and the cross-human interaction phenomenon has ensured this.

Do you think these ways of socialising will ever replace human bonding entirely? No. Not even close, at least for the vast majority.

How big is the internet? How big can it get? Do you want the simple answer or the very long and complicated (but still not complete) answer?

The simple one! Oh dear....

:SBallesvoorje The long one then? It's kinda impossible to say exactly, but it easily scales well and can do for a long time yet. This is because there is practically no centralisation of the internet, and the capacity of servers and network equipment will continue to stay ahead of the growing demand for years, if not decades, to come. Let's forget "local" internet matters for now, because that's not the internet. Let's see the following....

Submarine telecommunication cables - These are like huge bridges connecting islands and continents together carrying nearly all internet and standard phone/fax traffic between them. Currently there are hundreds of them around the world now, and most of them are nowhere near reaching capacity. In fact, usually the telecom companies have been at least one step ahead of demand and the capacity of each new cable (which typically lasts 20 - 30 years) follows Moore's Law (doubles every 2 years) closer than the demand does now. The newest cables today take advantage of various cutting-edge technologies to exchange more bits at a time, and is set to quadruple easily in the near future. And in the more distant future there may be hollow-core fibres, which not only can carry hundreds of physically-separate-channels per fibre but also allow light to go faster (due to lower density medium), reducing latency by about 30%. Some have even demonstrated using "twisted" light, to exponentially encode a lot more data!

Subterranean telecom cables - These can follow the submarine ones, although it can be more of a pain to install....relatively speaking. There are a lot more of these anyway, connecting data centres, DSLAM's, homes, businesses, etc to each other or to their ISP or network provider. Where there already is cable ducts and such laid, more cables can be installed relatively easily especially since fibre optics can be quite thin and light weight. However it'll get to a point where replacing them with a much higher capacity (and lower latency) one will be better. As technology improves costs may come down while abilities rise. They don't need as much shielding, planning or such as marine cables though, which has helped the countless buildings install them.

Data centres and server rooms - The former is expensive but worthy to build. There're probably hundreds if not thousands of them around the world now. One can even turn disused factories or depots or such into data centres, so there's no real concern about growth here yet. Some of these impressive buildings can house 10's or even 100's of thousands of servers, with each server serving as many as 10,000 users simultaneously! In some areas and some countries however there is little room for more big buildings so they tend to convert existing ones instead. Server rooms in places like offices are a bit trickier for growth, but many choose to house their servers in a data-centre anyway where it's safer, securer, etc and has better connection. Really the biggest limit to data centres currently is connectivity, as 100,000 x Gbit connections could swamp a 100 Tbit total DC connectivity....and not many even have 1+ Tbit yet. In fact, most DC's have more servers connections than their out-of-building connectivity can handle but never meet this limit besides external DDoS attacks. Most external DDoS attacks may target one or few servers while some just make it to the first network device in, which also would overload that way in.

Servers - These computers serve users, store data, process data, make magical spells called data....just kidding....but they can generate data on their own. A server blade can in fact hold as many drives, RAM modules, CPU's, etc as a desktop tower can if not more. Actually, it's not unusual to have a server with 8 x 4 TB hard drives in a RAID array, 2 or more CPU's each with 8+ cores (2x for hyper-threading) and quad channels DDR4 each with 4 slots holding 16 GB modules, several 1 Gbit or a few 10 Gbit ethernet ports with high performing network interface card processors with heat-sinks on them, etc....but even a budget laptop from 2007 can host a web server today and have a few visitors or more depending on the contents and activity. Remember most websites are quite small compared to Facebook and Google, only needing something like a budget laptop and a few GB of storage to run happily. Few online services require multiple servers to host now. Yes, Moore's Law outpaced the size and demand of most online services.

IP addresses - A mythconception even spread by so-called experts describes IPv4 as "running out of room" or suggesting that the internet will stop growing after the number of addresses available runs out. This is not true, as things like NAT allow public IPv4 sharing and online services like websites can also share an IP address although without a domain name it'll be hard to distinguish different ones of the same kind of service (and port number) behind the same address. More servers can be added, although maybe not public-facing ones, even if the host provider has ran out of addresses to give. For home users this is less of a problem but if they want a lot more computerised devices or ones with public-facing addresses it is a problem. The internet will continue to function well, just not grow like it did. It'll eventually stifle innovation, businesses growth and such though. But there is a cure for all this - IPv6, which is designed to replace v4, however it'll be a while yet before it'll be universal. By universal I mean global, like, for everyone, for every device, y'know, compatibility and all that stuff. How many more addresses does IPv6 give? 79,228,162,514,264,337,593,543,950,336 times more. Times more? Yes. All of them? No, a small portion of those addresses (again) have been allocated (designated) for public WAN use, but there's still enough to give every house....no every person....billions of billions of addresses to use at a time, while still room for many more Earths, and if needed more portions can be allocated for public WAN. It'll be more than enough to uniquely address every device for each day in this world for a very long time, if not longer than humans will exist.

Traffic and such - I'm getting tired now so I'll just leave this here for you to get an idea of the (probable) number of stuff going on over the net....on average: http://www.internetlivestats.com/ (Yeah, over 46 TB per second. That would need the equiv. of 3,700 x 100 Gbps links)

So in other words, it's already freaking unimaginably huge and diverse. And it can get much, much, much bigger. And stuff.
Community Rules | Newcomer FAQ | Our MC server FAQ | Our TF2 server FAQ
Need help with AGN? Check out the Tech forum.
Drop in suggestions or complaints in Suggestions forum.
Is it a private matter? PM me!
AGN's Twitter: @AceGamersNetwrk

"Creativity is intelligence having fun." - Albert Einstein

Return to “Technology, Philosophy and Science”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest